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FDP Forum / Miscellaneous and Non-Fender Topics / Vox Busket 5W

white crow

Greece

May 31st, 2018 01:40 PM   Edit   Profile  

Sorry, Vox Escort old Busker little Amp
-with an r not a t.
Can I use the extention output to hook to a VC108 with 25W? Am I wright to believe speakers should be smaller Watts than the amp?
Is it Ok to use the extention output to hook onto a different amp, like the Master Lead Combo? This is to play around clean tones. This Vox has a tone pot that really draws different sound variations.

(This message was last edited by white crow at 03:46 PM, May 31st, 2018)

Peegoo
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A dog

in a cake shop
May 31st, 2018 02:20 PM   Edit   Profile  

There are three types of audio signal, and they are referenced by the levels of voltage present in them.

If this is the little battery/mains-powered Vox Escort Busker with the 5.5" speaker and 2.5 watts of power, the output jack is a speaker-level jack. This means you must run it directly to a speaker cabinet.

If you run it into the front end of an amp you will damage the amp it's plugged into, because amps are designed to take mic-level signals at their inputs, not speaker-level signals. Speaker levels reach many volts.

Mic levels (guitar pickups generally match mic-levels) are measured in millivolts (a few thousandths of one volt).

Line level is the third type of signal, and this is used as the interconnect voltage between pro audio gear, e.g., between a mixer and a PA amplifier.

So with your Vox, use a speaker cable (not an instrument cable) to send the signal to a speaker cabinet.

Here's some info

white crow

Greece

May 31st, 2018 02:46 PM   Edit   Profile  

Thanks very much. That is very helpful. I did not know there are 1/4 jack speaker cables. I thought all 1/4 's where the same. Yes this is the second version busker amp, with mains. The Vox VC108 is a speaker cabinet, and reads up to 25W. The question is will the VC damage the little amp?

(This message was last edited by white crow at 04:48 PM, May 31st, 2018)

SonicBlue

Sunbury-on-Thames

May 31st, 2018 03:01 PM   Edit   Profile  

The 2.5 Watts of the Vox will not damage the 25 Watt speaker in any way.

As long as the power rating of a speaker is equal to or greater than the power output of the amplifier driving it, all will be well.

10W amp, 20W speaker, all good.

20W amp, 10W speaker will end in tears.

Do you mean the BC108?

(This message was last edited by SonicBlue at 05:03 PM, May 31st, 2018)

Peegoo
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A dog

in a cake shop
May 31st, 2018 03:07 PM   Edit   Profile  

Παρακαλώ!

white crow

Greece

May 31st, 2018 10:33 PM   Edit   Profile  

OK,
I see Greek words. Always happy to know there are good Greek guys in the US! That's encouraging.
10W amp into a 25W cab OK.
I wasn't thinking of damaging the speaker, but the amp. I remember I was told that if the amp is 2,5W and connect it loud into a 20W speaker, what would die would be the amp rather than the cab; but I remember this conversation was about a HiFi stereo Harman &Kardon into bookshelf JBL's, theamp being 45W, the speakers 70W or something like that. Perhaps we are talking about two completely different things here.
This would explain why you say 🎩2,5W>25W🎓, or else: you can play a 2,5W amp through a 20W speaker.

(This message was last edited by white crow at 06:57 AM, Jun 1st, 2018)

Peegoo
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A dog

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Jun 1st, 2018 05:55 AM   Edit   Profile  

It's a capacity thing. Allow me to put it into perspective for you.

2.5 liters of wine will go into an empty 20-liter barrel no problem. However, if you pour 10 liters of wine into a 5-liter container, there will be a lot of sparks, anger, and sadness.

I've been to the Athens Wine festival more than once :o)

The important thing to remember about speaker wattage is this: wattage does not equal volume. Wattage is the rate that energy is used.

For a speaker, a wattage rating is a reference number that lets you know about the speaker's ability to dissipate heat. If you exceed the wattage rating of a speaker, you are sending it more power than it can safely handle, and it will overheat and possibly melt the voice coil.

The good news is that the vast majority of speakers are very conservatively rated for wattage limits. The reason is because amplifiers can sometimes create transient spikes twice or three times their RMS power output level. Meaning--a 100 watt amp might send a split-second 200-watt signal to a speaker.

Rick Knight
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St Peters, MO USA

It must be true. It was on the internet.
Jun 1st, 2018 07:48 AM   Edit   Profile  

Are you able to verify that the extension speaker’s ohms rating meets the amplifier’s recommendation?

white crow

Greece

Jun 1st, 2018 12:12 PM   Edit   Profile  

No, sofar I am not. Tried Vox Showroom manual for the BM1 "busker" escort, no luck. Tomorrow I 'll look at itin day light, see if there are any markings. I will also ring Vox an email and see what they say regarding speaker Ohm and extention.
Thanks for asking.

Peegoo
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A dog

in a cake shop
Jun 1st, 2018 01:17 PM   Edit   Profile  

According to the manual (it's a one-pager; see link below), you can run the signal from the output jack to the input of another amp. In other words, you can use the Escort as a preamp, which is what you originally asked about.

Although the manual does not specifically state line level, it must be a line-level signal at the jack because it advises setting of the Escort's volume control for a "pleasing" sound.

You can test this by measuring the voltage from that jack with a multimeter set to read peak AC volts.

If you play through the amp with the volume cranked and get a peak voltage reading somewhere in the vicinity of 0.3 to 2 vAC, it is line level.

click here

SonicBlue

Sunbury-on-Thames

Jun 2nd, 2018 04:54 AM   Edit   Profile  

Right, a little research (a friend of mine bought one at a car boot sale a few years ago, hence the interest) has cleared up the output jack function.

Looking at the schematic the output jack is fed from a potential divider (1 meg and 10k), so the signal on it is about one hundredth of the output voltage. This means it isn't an extension speaker output, there's not enough signal present.

Looking at the spec sheet for the TBA810 amplifier module, the two 9V batteries and a 4 ohm speaker will provide the 2.5 watts as specified. When running flat out this means there'll be a little over 3V at the speaker, so there'll be one hundredth of this, or around 30mV at the output jack. This is at the upper end of mic level, or the sort of signal which comes directly out of a guitar when you smash a power chord. Given that you won't be running the Vox flat out when using it as a preamp, the output jack can be said to be a mic level output and can go directly into the instrument input of a bigger amplifier.
Unfortunately there's not enough signal present to drive an extension cabinet.

http://www.accelarata.com/datasheets/TBA810.pdf

Vox Escort schematic

(This message was last edited by SonicBlue at 06:56 AM, Jun 2nd, 2018)

white crow

Greece

Jun 2nd, 2018 08:43 AM   Edit   Profile  

OK, I see. So I can run it into a guitar input on any guitar amp, regardless Ohms and/or Watt of both the vox and the other amp, but I should use a mic level 1/4" jack with cable. I can't use a guitar 1/4" jack cable , one that I use to plug in a guitar.
Do all preamps work like that? Their output level is of a mic line, hence the mic level 1/4" jack-cable?
I once had a red cable fitted with 2 1/4's on both ends so I could use it as my guitar cable. It reads mic cable. Will this do the job?
Thanks,

SonicBlue

Sunbury-on-Thames

Jun 2nd, 2018 09:22 AM   Edit   Profile  

Yep, any cable you can use for a guitar can be used here.

A preamp, or virtually any guitar stomp box for that matter, will have 1/4 inch jacks on the input and output and standard guitar cables can be used.

I'm a little unclear about your red cable. Does it really have 2 1/4" jacks on each end, or do you mean it has 2 1/4" jacks, one on each end?

If it's one on each end like a normal guitar cable it should work to join your Vox to a bigger amp.

white crow

Greece

Jun 2nd, 2018 09:45 AM   Edit   Profile  

Yes,
well english gets funny, doesn't it, when it is not your spoken language. This is interesting as a new cable gift idea. If I had a girl friend who played the guitar, whome I wouldn't want to part for sometime, we could be playing "side by side", using this cable. I would call it a "keep your girl friend and your amp always next to you"!!
I was expecting to learn more about the electronics of a guitar. I did not expect I would be improveing my english at the same time!😃

white crow

Greece

Jun 2nd, 2018 09:51 AM   Edit   Profile  

It could also be a stereo cable, rca on one end, rca with 1/4" jack adaptors on the other, so you can use an amp's two chanels at once. No, this I only saw on the internet, but have never thought about doing it. It was just a wrong set of words to expresss something real simple like "mono guitar cable".

(This message was last edited by white crow at 03:20 AM, Jun 3rd, 2018)

FDP Forum / Miscellaneous and Non-Fender Topics / Vox Busket 5W




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